Both Foregiving and Foregetting LO24023

From: AM de Lange (
Date: 02/22/00

Replying to LO23992 --

Dear Organlearners,

Andrew Campona < > writes:

>Dear At,
>Later this year I hope to conduct an experiment in
>'real time' via this List. It will involve in a subtle but
>penetrating way some of the heartfelt issues driving
>this list. The experiment for those few who choose
>that way, pathway, will involve fear and some anxiety
>and other emotions and intellectualisations ......

Greetings Andrew,

I love experiments. I cannot wait for your one. I hope it will happen
because it is very frustrating to plan an experiment and then having to
wait for the opportunity to do it.

>It will involve three 'institutions' on condition that I can
>organise the 'virtual laboratory,' The LO, the University of
>Cambridge and the University of Oxford. I mention this by
>way of preparation!

You are biting a very large chunck. I ask myself how you are going to
"organise" a university? Organising a small part of it is already
difficult enough -- organising the whole of it requires a LO. No LI
(Learning Individual) is capable of doing it.

>This LO list is like all 'organisations' is perhaps perfectly
>full of those who ruthlessly exploit the list's 'present energy'
>for themselves, (one to one mappings) and those who
>ruthlessly exploit themselves for the list's future energy.
>(One to many mappings)

In another reply to you today I wrote that ownership comes through
self-creating and that the joy of ownership is to give freely away.

Painting rich pictures requires some tenacity and sacrifices. But they
are extremely important to trace the becoming of each of us.

>Question. It is true that the ruthless exploitation of any
>'system' brings a more agreeable life, but for how long?

I think the answer is linked to the lack of mutual care and thus the
(back) reaction to make up for it by planning for a carefree life. A
carefree life does not last.

>Now back to ways of the heart. Werner Heisenberg is
>quoted by Capra, ' It is probably true generally that in the
>history of human thinking the most fruitful developments
>frequently take place at those points where two different
>lines of thought meet. These lines may have their roots
>in quite different parts of human culture, in different times
>or different cultural environments or different religious
>traditions: hence if they actually meet, that is, if they are
>at least so much related that a real interaction can take
>place, then one may hope that new and interesting
>developments may follow.'

Andrew, one may already learn that lesson in high school chemistry.
Allotropism is something which we find only in some of the 92 pure
elements. It happens when identical atoms (they are identical because they
are of the same element) combine in different manners, leading to
different macroscopical forms for that element. The best know example is
the allotropism of sulfur.

We have far less than 100 cases of allotropism, yet we have millions of
different compounds when different elements combine with each other.

I think that what Internet is accomplishing, is to help people breaking
through the ceiling of "cultural allotropism". Books can do that too, but
reading a sufficient collection of them also requires some tenacity and
sacrifies. A few books, all on the same topic, will never do.

>Anyone 'vaguely' interested in the aforementioned
>experiment please watch this space : - )

You bet ;-)

With care and best wishes


At de Lange <> Snailmail: A M de Lange Gold Fields Computer Centre Faculty of Science - University of Pretoria Pretoria 0001 - Rep of South Africa

Learning-org -- Hosted by Rick Karash <> Public Dialog on Learning Organizations -- <>

"Learning-org" and the format of our message identifiers (LO1234, etc.) are trademarks of Richard Karash.