Energy laws and beyond LO27150

From: Dressler, Winfried (
Date: 08/20/01

Replying to LO27072 --

>I hope this will be an interesting dialogue

Hi Gavin,

>I am not so sure that the positron is the same thing that I am talking
>about (dark energy, anti gravity). I do believe that anti-matter can have
>no mass or temperature (the holy grail of absolute zero) and therefore
>falls outside our present understandings of science and will need a
>paradigm shift to understand.

I suspect, Rick will be wondering what may come out of this ;-). I am
wondering too: Do I have experiential knowledge of "anti-matter"? Even
tacit knowledge? Let me try to check.

[Host's Note: Yes, I am wondering... ]

I have heard of anti-matter only in the context of elementary particles
physics (electron-positron, proton-antiproton, photon being its own
antiparticle). I find the organization of mind extraordinary that enabled
to harness the elementary particles "zoo" that was started to be observed
by means of colliders. Yet in your categorization these particles do all
belong to matter, right? Anyhow, they do not matter :-) for our dialogue,
I suspect except for the question: How do they organize? from which we may
learn something.

Scientists have observed that when particle and anti-particle collide,
they annihilate, while energy, momentum, charges remain conserved.
Speaking of organization, one may say the energy which is bound in the
mass of the particles is set free. A creative collapse. What happens next?
Do we get something of more complex organization (emergence) or something
of less complex organization (immergence)? Most particles that are created
are unstable or metastable. What does stability mean in the organization?
>From some stable particles the world of atoms emerge. From stable atoms
the world of molecules emerge and so on up to the world of mind? and
beyond??. The world of matter, as you say. The dance of LEP on LEC.

We use metaphors from different levels of organization to describe what
happens in our mind, thinking, communicating, organizing. I feel familiar
with the image that thoughts build complex molecules, that some thoughts
can act as catalyst to create even more complex thoughts and so on. May be
others than I can see a correspondence between a personal experience and
the annihilation of thought and anti-thought into pure creative energy,
some of them experiencing immergence others emergence out of this.

What really would go beyond for me would be the experience that mind is
more than the organization of matter and the paradoxes which arise when
mind becomes selfreferential. Thus that there is another organization that
remains or even evolve further when the body (organization of matter)
decompose. Whatever "evolving organization" (learning) may mean "beyond".

Liebe Gruesse,


"Dressler, Winfried" <>

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